This article has been converted into a chapter in my book Revise Us Again.
Frank Viola | Beyond Evangelical
Official Blog of Author & Speaker Frank Viola. Digging below the surface and moving beyond the shallows in today's Christianity.
The Wrong Starting Point
So You Think You Disagree? 4 Reasons Why You May Not
Next time the LOTR and Hobbit movies as an analogy? 😉
Thanks for writing the ‘Revise us again’ book. I really appreciate it.
frank, i get so engrossed reading and listening anything i can get for free about this revelation of Christ as life as an eternal reality that must fill in every believer’s life. your web site is just so rich with the stamp of that substance. And you have been gifted by the Holy Spirit with such eloquence and clarity to translate the eternal realities in Christ into into a simple and straightforward word that can be easily grasp in our minds who’s just beginning in the exercise of this spiritual learnings. Thank God for you. there were materials though in your site and book you’ve written that i desperately want to grab and read, but for a citizen of a third word country like me, i just can’t afford them!
thank you.
Thx. for the kind words. All of these articles are free – https://www.frankviola.org/articles … as well as the podcast library https://www.frankviola.org/podcast. We also give away free eBooks to those who get my personal updates: https://www.frankviola.org/network.html
I’m delighted to find this site. It’s rich with content. I’m just starting my blog with an emphasis on the topic of faith. I suspect Frank’s work will make some excellent source quotes for my future wrirings! Thanks again.
Thanks for this, Frank. Refreshing! But it doesn’t make Paul the Cat’s Meow, prrr prrr. 😎
Thanks. And you are correct, Paul wasn’t a cat. He was a human. So we agree.
I was taught once that the first things GOD tells us of Himself is that He was already there in the “beginning” and that He is “creative/creator.” Do I think that everyone begins their dialogue with, and their journey to GOD at Genesis 1…no. We are all at different places asking different questions being prompted by different conflict within. However, I do believe that the first things GOD reveals of Himself are some of the first things we must grasp before we can begin to recognize who we are in relation to who HE is…and those truths are such a necessary foundation for all else he will reveal…
Thank you for sharing this perspective, Frank. I really appreciate your emphasis on understanding the narrative story of God that is revealed in the Scriptures. Certainly, getting things in order reveals so much. God’s ageless purpose is the whole pie. Redemption of humanity is just a slice.
Hi Frank,
Amen, it’s really important to know God’s eternal purpose from Genesis 1 but not from Genesis 3. I was blown away when I first heard the message on this topic from Lance Lambert some years ago. Thank the Lord that He gave you burden and words to express this to more people. Just as Paul prayed in Ephesians 1, we really need the Spirit of wisdom and revelation so that we could understand and be led into the reality.
Amen. As grating as it may sound, eternal purpose > redemption. The “re” is a dead give away. A question I’ve asked is Did God create us merely to redeem us? Of course, that purpose is right there in Romans and Galatians equally as much, just in different language.
It’s faintly in Galatians, but clearly in Romans 8.
Great Post Frank! Thanks for sharing!
Hi Frank,
I agree with the perspective, of God’s revealed word, that you share. I am continually concerned about the church’s lack of importance on what Christ has brought to us concerning the true and infallible love of God. Man, if we could just catch a glimpse of the amazing place we have in Christ and hold on to it….Whoa! Yea, the symphony would be beyond Handel! Thanks brother for the voice of Christ speaking through you.
Great thoughts brother. To consider God’s “eternal purpose” as the “beginning” of our theology is a great thought and needed. Thanks for sharing.
I recently discovery your writing and your blog. I love your perspective and I have been greatly encouraged by the what you write and what you have to say. I am literally devouring everything you have written and said as if I had not had a good meal in my life. Thank you for sharing the life and the wisdom God has given you.
I am a little confused by this statement, “Consider this fact. Human beings didn’t come into this world in need of salvation. There was a purpose in God that came before the fall, and He has never let go of it.”
Isn’t our need the vessel through which God has chosen to lavish upon us “the riches of God’s grace.”? (Eph. 1:7-8) Stated another way, if there was no fall and mankind was not bound to the law of sin and death, how would God be able to demonstrate the depths of his love for us? His faithfulness? His unlimited grace? His rich mercy? What value would the law of the Spirit and the life he has to offer us be if God had some other “pre-fall” plan or agenda?
It seems to me that God has always intended to reveal His glory through our flaws, failures and need. I can not imagine God creating mankind without the fall. What would we be able to reveal to all of God’s creation (that I am told even makes the angels marvel) if we did not have the need for salvation?
I am no theologian or pastor. I am just a guy who reads His bible almost everyday trying to understand what is says about who God is and who I am in Him, so please don’t take my questions as backhanded rebuttal of the point you are trying to make. I am just trying to understand your point so that I can keep up with the conversation.
Thanks for all you do to serve Christ and His bride.
I only have a second, but I deal with this very question in “From Eternity to Here.” It all comes down to understanding Genesis 1 and 2, both of which occurred before the fall and which reappear in Rev. 21 and 22 when the fall is erased. Those themes are traced throughout the entire Bible in the book and redemption is discussed in that context. http://https://www.frankviola.org/frometernitytohere/
Thanks for the response. I will read that book and get back to you with any further questions I have. Right now, I am reading Pagan Christianity, Reimagining Church and Finding Organic Church. I am also listening to all of your Podcasts. I really enjoyed the sermon you entitled, “Diary of a Desperate Woman.” I also receive great encouragement from your daily blog posts. You will have to forgive some of my uniformed questions for the time being. I am new to the language you are speaking and I have not read a lot Christian authors who express their faith and life with God the way that you do.
Thanks. Just for clarification, that was a message not a sermon. 😉
Jason,
It is exciting to read about your devouring our Lord. I hope you keep falling in love with Him. That way you will see how God will just keep unfolding Himself to you. What a beautiful experience.
Thank you, thank you, thank you. Could it be possible that the Christian story begins with Jesus Christ? Who would have thought?!
Brilliant analogy Frank. Fits beautifully. I’m not a Star Wars fan but I have seen all the episodes and it always bothered me that they showed them in reverse order. The metaphor is perfect in what we’ve done with the biblical story. Great post!
Great! I love the Stars Wars analogy. I grew up in the 70s/80s and always thought the story were about Luke Skywalker. Only when watching the series from the beginning do you realize the real story is about Darth Vader. His journey from the innocence of young Anakin, to his “fall”, to his redemption.
The first three chapters of the Bible describe our purpose. The other 1187 tell us how we forsook it, how Jesus restored it, and how we can fulfill it. “Breathtaking”… INDEED!!
Except that episodes 1, 2, & 3 were awful! You have to find a better metaphor. 🙂
Never criticize something unless you can improve upon it. Some angel said that. 🙂
I agree that we have been guilty of a wrong starting point concerning the gospel. Indeed, it is right to start with the plans and purposes of God. I would like to say, though, that Peter and Paul had the same gospel, evident by their sermons in Acts 2 and Acts 13.
Your book “From Eternity to Here” has helped me in more ways than I ever thought a book could (or should!!). I enjoyed all of your books, but that one, by far, has impacted me the most.
THANK YOU
How very interesting! John C. Nugent in a recent book analyzing John H. Yoder’s view of the OT and application to ethics (“The Politics of Yahweh”, John C. Nugent, 2011) makes the same assertion. He also uses the idea of a “prequel” to understand the full story (Star Wars was more about the redemption of Anakin than it was the heroic “coming of age” of Luke). If our trajectory of the story of God starts with Genesis 1 (and even some ideas of prelapsarian creation), than the broad arrow of the trajectory of the story can encompass a LOT more and with greater cohesion the total mission of God rather than starting with a midpoint somewhere in the Gospels or in the later Genesis chapters.
Rather cool that two “scholars” come to very similar conclusions.
Wow, I love it. This takes the focus and center off ourselves and gives it back to Christ. Instead of the question of what’s our purpose, we get in line with His purpose. Thanks for sharing.